Religion in politics, that’s a good topic. First it’s probably good to define both religion and politics for the discussion. What is religion? To me it’s your core spiritual beliefs and what guides you as to right and wrong on a moral level. Politics to me is the practical governing of your surroundings but for this conversation lets say its our local, state, and national govt.
Since govt makes the laws we as a society live by why on earth wouldn’t you want those people in govt to make those laws based on their moral beliefs? Now before you say because those in govt are worthless pieces of crap remember that you elected them to be there!
Religion always has and always will be in politics. There is no way to separate the two, nor should it be attempted. Laws are based in morality. We create laws to protect each other and to maintain civility. It is morally wrong to kill someone so we make laws against murder. It’s morally wrong to be a thief so we make laws against stealing. The point is we govern ourselves based on our collective perception of right and wrong. That perception is formed from our beliefs. One of the ways we gain our beliefs is from our religion. Since the majority of the people in this country claim a Christian faith it is only natural that the law would be influenced by Christianity. To ignore religion in the process of making laws is not realistic.
If a politician can leave his/her religion at the door when he enters congress, White House, etc, then I certainly don’t want anything to do with them. If they can check their morality at the door then that means they will make immoral laws. Now who wants that?
July 7, 2008 at 4:36 pm
Thats the difference between us and the animals.
In the animal world there is no morality. They dont decide right and wrong, they decide based on survival. They do what they need to in order to survive. The human species has raised itself to a platform that no longer has to consider survival. Now we have morals, an established belief system that tells us things are right or wrong. It doesnt matter whether you are Christian, Buddhist, Muslim…by and large the core of those values are the same.
Now that we are on that pedestal, we look down and have forgotten what life or death means. If a Male Lion was to have his pride attacked, he would defend it, to the death if necessary. If a human kills another human, we turn the other cheek. We feed, shelter, and clothe that person until the day they die. Which is something we dont even do for our poor. Somehow that act makes us feel that we are above the animals.
When you think about it, the more our “Morals” turn us away from the reality of nature, the more “civilized” we feel. In the world of nature, the weak die, the strong survive and get stronger. In the “civilized” world we protect the weak, we allow them to reproduce, we allow them to become a part of our society, in fact, we welcome it. Who would consider building a house or a car and intentionally using inferior materials? Not a single person out there. But thats exactly what our “civilization” does. If that doesn’t at least make you wonder, even for an instance, where our “civilization” is headed, well, then I guess your blinders are better than mine.
Im not saying our ways are right. Im not saying our ways are wrong. Im saying our “morals” have led us in a direction that wouldnt work in nature and every now and then, we just might want to reflect back on how we got to be the superior species on this planet.
July 8, 2008 at 12:59 pm
So what do you propose to fix it? You’re not condoning a “Lord of the Flies” type of life are you? I don’t think any of us want to go to the grocery store and have to go toe-to-toe with someone for a box of cereal and a gallon of milk. I think civility is a good thing. The problems you describe above such as feeding and clothing worthless POS’s instead of administering justice are not because of our morals but because of a decay of those morals.
We seem to promote mediocrity instead of excellence. Our schools tend to teach to the least common denominator, I see many people that don’t hold their children to a higher standard both in their learning environment as well as their social one. If people set the bar low for their kids that’s exactly what they’ll achieve. If its set higher then guess what; that’s where our children will end up. Morals haven’t caused our problems, not adhering to them has.
July 8, 2008 at 4:28 pm
Well back up there a minute, I specifically stated that I was neither condemning or condoning the situation, just stating how we got where we are.
I submit that we need to quit treating everyone as equals (GASP!!). Lets stop carrying the weak link and let them drag themselves along. Lets inspire our kids to achieve greatness, not settle for mediocrity.
Following the rules of society should have benefits, not following the rules should have consequences. Thats how I run my house, and it works pretty well there. You basically have 3 levels of people in any situation – those who cause trouble, those who stay out of trouble but never do anything positive, and those who strive to achieve excellence. A murderer should not have the same rights as a law abiding citizen. A citizen who is a part of society but never takes that step to serve society shouldnt be rewarded as a veteran or police officer. You reward the type of activity you want, you dont punish or reward those who are in society but never contribute to it, and you punish those who break the rules. Problem is getting people to agree on what a benefit and a punishment is.
A classic example of this is how school used to be. If you listen in class and did what you had to, you passed the class. No honor roll, no detention for you. Those who didnt listen or do their homework failed and got no credit for the class, or got kicked out of class, or got sent to detention. Those who knuckled down and tried hard got good grades, honor roll, and possible scholarships.
Punish the bad, reward the excellent, encourage the mediocre to excellence. Just dont reward the middle for being average, because then, thats all they will ever be.
July 8, 2008 at 5:12 pm
Well said, I couldnt agree more. I try to hold my boys to a higher standard and instill what you’ve described. The difficult part is when you see so many others that dont. Makes you wonder what it will be like for them when they are adults.
July 9, 2008 at 5:27 pm
My thoughts are about the same as Jason’s and I couldn’t find fault with anything he stated. To correlate our civilized existance to nature as was done by Keith is not an equitable comparison. Creatures in nature behave much like our criminals do in prison or some area where there are no rules or laws being enforced. I do not want my family to live in this type of environment. I believe it is the secular liberal influence that has degraded our society and is continuing to do so in an aggressive manner. I predict if Obama wins the next election which I do not believe will happen, that our Nation will reach a point of no return, assuming he survives what nature will throw at him in short order.
July 10, 2008 at 12:28 pm
I am going back over what I wrote, and I dont know if I was unclear or you misinterpreted what I wrote.
The looked up the word “correlate”. It means to compare similarities. The FIRST line of my post says “Thats the difference between us and the animals” then I go to list how our society is different than the animal world. In my comment I was trying to note how our “Civilized” ways go against all natural processes, thus explain a possible reason for our decline in morality and prosperity. I don’t want to live in a situation where there are no rules or boundaries either, but I’m saying we need to make the world a place where there are consequences for not following the rules, and there are rewards if you act positively. Simply following the herd and being a piece of the puzzle should be accepted, but not rewarded.
Now a good use of the term “Correlation” would be to say our present society in America is becoming more and more like Rome before the decline of that empire. Their rich got extravagantly wealthy, had little or nothing to fear from the militia. The poor got poorer, abused and downtrodden. The military overreached its arm and was spread thin enough that the once mighty armies could no longer protect their homeland. How about the fact that the massive influx of Germans into the Roman culture led to greater divisiveness and lower loyalty. There are certainly some similarities between Rome and America, don’t you think?
A point of no return? I would hope so. I dont want to return to what we have right now.
August 26, 2008 at 11:49 pm
That brings another CORRELATION to mind…
The Romans contributed to their demise by outsourcing what they needed done and then being unable to handle the consequences of that outsourcing.
In the same fashion, in an effort to save money (and their asses for promises they couldn’t keep), so many companies in this country have outsourced the work (as well as other labor) to manufacturers overseas, allowing the countries that are home to those manufacturers/laborers to become powerhouses themselves (interesting that we funded their ability to compete with us economically). The other interesting point beyond that is, how long will it take for those manufacturers to realise that they don’t need our designers to send plans for making a plastic toy or to stamp out a set of silverware or make anything that we gobble up at our local Wal-Mart, and they just make it themselves and ship it in and we continue to gobble. Then what? Are we in a state where we can’t provide for ourselves at all? This goes back to what Mr. Aycock was saying about domestic energy sources as well, not just the rash of other crap. I could probably write a book about the desintigration of our quality of life and Wal-Mart and it’s vendors’ part in it, but I’ll save that for a time when I write my own rant site…